I've changed my mind. Let the EDL march

I would like to extend an olive branch to those defenders of English nationalism.

By Dan Hodges Published 03 September 2011 11:57

Pragmatism. Magnanimity. A willingness to show compassion and understanding to friend and foe alike.

I possess none of these qualities. The world is black and white. I am right, you are wrong. If you are my opponent I must crush, not merely beat you.

That is how I have always conducted my politics. It has not been wholly successful. But it has got me as far as this web site, so I must have done something right.

None of us, though, have a monopoly on wisdom. Nor are our life choices set in stone. Occasionally one should listen to the views of others. Turn over a new leaf. Reach out.

You may have read in other places my criticism of the English Defence League [EDL]. I have used harsh, even coarse language against them. Most recently I have insisted their boots should not set foot on the streets of Tower Hamlets, and been critical of those who have adopted a different stance.

Here, today, I would like to make amends. I would like to extend an olive branch to those defenders of English nationalism, and those others who, on a point of principle, have spoken out for their right to free assembly and protest.

Let us compromise. Why don't we put aside our differences, and find a middle path.

Here is my offering. The EDL should be allowed to march. But with pre-conditions. One or two safeguards that will enable those of us who have been sceptical of their methods and motives to be reassured of their good faith.

My first offer is this. The EDL can demonstrate. But with a commitment that for the 24 hours proceeding and following their protest, none of those participating consumes alcohol. Not a drop. None of those strange alcopop type drinks favoured by EDL leader Tommy Robinson. Not even a small dry sherry. Abstinence is the price they should pay to demonstrate their passion for freedom of expression and the rule of law. Oh, and they should agree to be breath tested in advance of the march. Not that I don't trust the boys you understand. But as I said, it's a sign of good faith.

If this seems too draconian, I have a second offer. Again, they can march. But it must be in fancy dress. A certain percentage of the EDL's followers must embark on their demo wearing nun's habits. A further percentage in those weird Emu like costumes Bernie Clifton wears to run the London marathon. And so on. Oh, and there's one final control order. Tommy Robinson himself must wear a tutu. Not just a tutu, obviously. That would make him look ridiculous. And slightly obscene. He can still wear his jeans and black puffer, or his EDL hoodie. Actually, wer'e banning hoodies these days aren't we, so that's probably out.

And there you have it. The EDL nuns and emus can march proudly through streets of East London, and the rest of us can take our sandwiches and watch. The kids would love it.

Or if that doesn't work, perhaps because they can't get enough habits and tutus in such a short space of time, I have a third suggestion.

Much has been made of the fact that other marches have been proscribed by the Home Secretary. That is indeed troubling. So I propose this.

Instead of banning the marches, we merge them. The EDL, Unite Against Fascism [UAF], and East End gay pride should march together. As one. Divided by ideology, yes. But united in their commitment to free political expression.

Of course, and you knew this was coming didn't you, there's one further catch. They must hold hands. Not in one long line of solidarity. That would be impractical; Brick Lane is very narrow. But two by two.

I'd love it if we could manage boy-girl, boy-girl, but I'm not sure the EDL have enough female members. So it would have to be by group. EDL member/gay pride member, UAF supporter/EDL member, etc.

To add another nice twist, they should intersperse their chants. Though I find the regular protest chats of all three groups a bit dull. So we should spice it up a bit. The UAF should sing some rousing patriotic anthems. Land of Hope and Glory. Jerusalem of course. The odd rendition of "Five one, even Heskey scored". Meanwhile, the EDL could try a few show tunes. "I am what I am", "I'm gonn'a wash that man right out of my hair", "Gee, Officer Krupke". And Pride could have a go at some of the hits from the most recent Love Music Hate Racism gig; a bit of Captain Dale, Petrichor and Shredded Lives.

Pragmatism. Magnanimity. Understanding.

You know what, it's actually quite fun. Anyone got Tommy Robinson's phone number?

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Tags: EDL

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267 comments

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Sat, 2011-09-03 13:05 — Andy (not verified)

Dan doesnt believe in freedom of choice, its the leftie way or no way.
Its scum like him with his feeble attempts at being a comedian and avoiding the real issues that show his true colours.
I dont mean the usual theme of black or white.

Sun, 2011-09-04 17:58 — Luddite (not verified)

p j wall.. you are poisoned, full of shit!! no one wishes to listen to anymore...

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:05 — Umad Bro (not verified)

Well, I think you may have displeased some people judging by the comments... tragic :')

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:05 — Karyobin (not verified)

Dan, you lost me at the third paragraph I'm afraid. Unlike you, I always worked to the following principle: there are so many different views abounding - particularly in the political sphere - that, nutters aside, everyone is worth listening to. Nothing is black and white (again, nutters aside).

Your childish clinging to the myth of polar absolutes is what has brought you to this website (paragraph four). It's nothing to be proud of.

(By the way, before the 'racist/fascist' labels start flying in your defence, I'm counting the EDL in the nutters camp here. Some days I agree with a Labour point other days the Tories win the debate. It's my ability to acknowledge the grey that allows me this shift. It's an approach particularly useful in adulthood.)

Sun, 2011-09-04 18:04 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

"you don't change the battleground to that of destroying bit by bit their ideology, rather you make some silly jokes and hope they will go away"

Archibald, quite the contrary. I don't hope they'll go away I advocate the state forces them to go away by banning them.

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:07 — Andy (not verified)

@hova

Are you sure your not refering to the Notting Hill march were hundreds were arrested, and as far as i am aware no one is usually stabbed in EDl marches.
I couldnt care less wether its an EDL march,Gay pride march or UAF march everyone has a right to protest.

Fri, 2011-09-09 22:50 — Keith (not verified)

I think if you stop people from marching, Then you stop being a lefty you then become a dictator

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:11 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

"You can stick your olive branch up your fat patronising guilt tripped bourgy arse"

...won't be seeing you in a Tutu then John...?

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:12 — Stuart Eels (not verified)

Oh dear Dan Hodges, when you first came on these pages you were tearing them apart. Which at the time I thought was a bit harsh, I have now had the experience of seeing them trying their recruiting outside The Memorial Stadium. I would prefer to issue a banning order on them all!

Then what do you? invite them to a love-in. Whats a boy to do?

Luddite

They don't exclusively breed on the terraces you know.

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:13 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Andy,

...my boyfriends called Michelle, but I'll certainly put it to her...

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:15 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Karyobin,

...when it comes to fascists I find clinging to polar absolutes is usually the best policy...

Sun, 2011-09-04 18:34 — James (not verified)

p j wall, people like you are precisley the reason groups like the EDL get so much support. There is a very real problem with Islamic extemeism in places like Tower Hamlets which whenever anyone attempts to have a serious discussion about they get people like you shouting them down as racists or 'Islamaphobes'. As long as people in mainstream political discourse continue to do this people affected by issues suroudning Islamic extremism will continue to turn to groups like the EDL

Wed, 2011-09-07 22:58 — wallace (not verified)

EDL stands for the defenders of England as a whole, there shouldn't be any other organization with any spark of loyalty to oppose such patriots! So what's this shyte all about Danny-boy?

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:16 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Stuart,

...I know. I'm so fickle...

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:19 — jc (not verified)

Simple: EDL can march with, the very traditionally, English troupe of Morris Dancers leading the march

Sun, 2011-09-04 18:50 — Julia Harris (not verified)

PJ – your wrong in everything you say, firstly Islamphobia doesn’t exist, these are real concerns about Islam, not some irrational fear. Secondly I have some great Hindu, Seikh, Jewish, Black, Chinese friends etc etc, I have no problem with them being and living in the UK or anywhere else. What your doing is the typical PC response as soon as anyone speak truthfully about Islam, you get called a bigot or worse and your words are taken as Xenophobic.
All I can say is there is no shortage of people from all ethnics groups across the globe who are aware and fearful or Islam. Are the Hindu’s in India who fear the Muslims in Pakistan akin to the EDL? Are the Copts in Egypt who get there churches bombed EDL like?, The list goes on and one and one and on.

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:23 — A. Cole (not verified)

Dont forget the EDL was set up as a direct reaction to Islamic extremism when Luton's Anjem Choudhury heckled the returning soldiers.

The EDL are protesting against a real threat. In the East End we are seeing Islamists putting up 'Gay Free Zone' posters.

Then again the left always dig their heads in the sands when we try to discuss this threat...this is why the EDL exists!!

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:24 — Keith (not verified)

I think the EDL should march or at least have static protest simply because the police and other local councils let the extreme Muslim groups protest without any problems who in my mind are the biggest problem in this country causing hate and shouting abuse at returning soldiers.

Lets not forget if it wasn't for the extreme Muslim group in Luton we wouldn't have the EDL

But soon as the EDL want to march is goes as high as the government to stop them... Its one rule for them and one rule another

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:32 — Karyobin (not verified)

@Dan: A weak, cheap and unworthy response, and one rendered redundant by my including the EDL in the 'nutter camp' in my earlier post.

You began your article by crassly broadcasting your polar approach to all debate. In light of this self-confessed, upper-sixth attitude it is surely not unreasonable to assume that this admission applies to all spheres of politcal discourse that benefit from your shallowly-dipped toe.

It's easy to be black and white with regard to fascists. Adopting it as a blanket approach to politics is primtive beyond justification. It's why you feel so at home here.

Sun, 2011-09-04 19:20 — Pirate Prentice (not verified)

"I have some great Hindu, Seikh, Jewish, Black, Chinese friends etc etc, I have no problem with them being and living in the UK or anywhere else"

How benevolent of you.

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:35 — Sue Marsh (not verified)

Karyoben yeurgggh. Wishy- washy in-betweeners with no sense of direction, swaying like leaves in the Daily Mail breeze. I prefer Tories and that's quite a statement from me

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:36 — Infuriated Dudette (not verified)

Patronising scum that you are....your wife must be so ugly.....I'll wager you can't wait for burka wearing to be enforced to hide her downtrodden, weary face that shows signs of the years and bullshit she had endured from you. Traitor!!!

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:37 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Karyobin,

"A weak, cheap and unworthy response"

Maybe, but not as bad as this one.

Sun, 2011-09-04 19:38 — Eddy S (not verified)

@julia harris:

"All I can say is there is no shortage of people from all ethnics groups across the globe who are aware and fearful or Islam. Are the Hindu’s in India who fear the Muslims in Pakistan akin to the EDL? Are the Copts in Egypt who get there churches bombed EDL like?, The list goes on and one and one and on."

very true.

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:40 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

"Patronising scum that you are....your wife must be so ugly"

...and there was me starting to soften to you guys...

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:42 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Keith, you might want to check this out http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/wiltshire/8440408.stm

Sun, 2011-09-04 19:50 — Keith (not verified)

@Dan You do know outside of white chapel tube station Asian men hand out leaflets to spread hate... and when a white person ask to see what's on them they refuse.. you have to ask why?

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:45 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

"her downtrodden, weary face that shows signs of the years and bullshit she had endured from you"

...you've no idea how much she'd agree with you...

Sat, 2011-09-03 13:49 — Keith (not verified)

@Dan, I know they Banned that march, probably due how bad politically it would have been for then labour government but I was referring to the other marches they have had, like the one in Barking and in Luton when the returning soldiers were abused and branding murders etc... the police or government did not stop that for public safety reasons, when the one in barking nearly was full scale punch up..

Sun, 2011-09-04 19:56 — Keith (not verified)

again Dan could give us your views on extremist Muslim groups who call for sharia controlled Britain please?

I really like to know your view on these groups as you are fond in mocky groups like the EDL and the BNP

Thu, 2011-09-15 20:44 — JP3

Tell you what, after reading all that I've come to the conclusion if I ever have a son I'm naming him Adam. Pure win.

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:02 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

"Impose pre-conditions on the EDL by all means, but you must impose the same pre-conditions and harsher on students, hippies and the fascist left"

...the trouble is the students love any excuse to march in fancy dress...

Wed, 2011-09-07 05:16 — Mr. Divine (not verified)

Richard: I have read the Koran, travelled extensively through Islamic countries, have a number of Muslim friends and spoken to thousands of Muslims. What do you base your views of Islam on?

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:02 — JP3

Dan, you've seemingly managed to annoy the entire 'THEY'RE TAKING OVER!!!1!!11ONE11!!!' brigade on here in one swoop. And look, one even implied that *gasp* you might be gay, like it's an insult, oh the lols.

I tip my hat to you, sir.

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:05 — No2PC

So Dan the comedian, patronising sanctimonius middle class commissar, rolling around in white guilt. If you really cared about extremism in the east end your suburdan reptile mates in Hope not hate would have petitioned to stop Hz bu Tahir and MAC who have recently held events there. Where was your two faced organisation when stephen Tims was attacked or that teacher who was pulverised for teaching muzzie girls.Oh they were not white so that doesnt count as hate, it must because all this endless Islamophobia that made them do it. What about the gay free zones stickers? Or when the East London Barracks, sorry mosque incited murder of homosexuals. Not worthy of a mention eh?

Let the islamists bomb tubes, commit honour killings, train for jihad, incite hatred agianst unbelievers, and threaten gays 365 days a year but the EDL must not divide the east end today.

HYPOCRISY

Sun, 2011-09-04 20:19 — Tesco Shelf Stacker (not verified)

Can someone please explain why Peter Tatchell was in East London yesterday with the so-called anti-fascist crowd and their bed-fellows the islamists - protesting against the EDL? I understood he was holding a placard stating something like 'GAYS and MUSLIMS UNITE' (or something like that?). I'm not saying he should have sided with the EDL (its a free country - he can choose to do what he likes), but his decision seemed like a strange one to me considering the recent homophobic posters in Tower Hamlets and extremist events within the borough that continue to preach hatred towards homosexuals among the muslim community there (where is Peter Tatchell when these happen?). For me this decision was wrong - it seemed like a case of hoping the crocodile will eat you last if you're nice enough to it.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S7rxAeF1wmQ

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:05 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Flashbuck,

"shove your pre-conditions and your patronizing piffle".

'Patronizing. Treat with an apparent kindness that betrays a feeling of superiority'.

Have to say, you make the felling of superiority bit pretty easy.

Sun, 2011-09-04 20:19 — AdamX (not verified)

Latest British athletics world champion is called Mohammed. Is he integrated?
Keith - As someone who has lived in Whitechapel for many years...yes you are right there are morons who do hand out leaflets calling for Sharia, put up stickers etc. They stand about sometimes, about six, seven of them, saying "they're fackin' disprespectin Islam mate. You fackin' understand? Stick youre fackin lefty crap mate." I should know i've actually argued with them. Like you they are halfwitted cultural nationalists, born in the UK, ignorant, semi educated, internet warriors. And like you they claim to represent huge numbers but when it comes down to the knuckle barely anyone gives a shit what they say.
But you both hate left wingers, liberals etc. So much in common.

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:07 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

"So Dan the comedian, patronising sanctimonius middle class commissar, rolling around in white guilt'

...we've clearly met...

Sun, 2011-09-04 20:23 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

OK Keith, why?

Thu, 2011-09-08 02:05 — Mr. Divine (not verified)

So Keith do you want to stop the US pastor burning the Koran? Or do you want to stop the Muslim cleric burning the US flag in revenge? Or both?

Should the US pastor be allowed to burn the Koran? He's just inflaming the situation.

Mon, 2011-09-12 19:41 — Keith (not verified)

I see they allowed the extremist Muslims to protest on Sunday, It makes a mockery of the EDL banned and it shows it one rule for them and another rule for others and makes the people in charge a bunch of HYPOCRITES!!!

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:08 — Dan Hodges (not verified)

Keith,

If people want to abuse returning soldiers I'd ban them as well.

Sun, 2011-09-04 20:27 — AdamX (not verified)

Tesco - What are you objecting to? Homophobia? Or just homophobia from anyone muslim? Homophobia is alive and well in every set of people in the world. Do you object to Russian gay marches being attacked by police, gays gassed and beaten? Post much on the internet about that?

Wed, 2011-09-07 07:48 — Richard Albright (not verified)

Allah will reward believing men with "fair ones" (beautiful women) in heaven. 55:71-72. What about the Ladies. Mr Divine?

Those in the Garden will be attended by immortal youths with wide, lovely eyes. 56:17-23. 'Lustful fantasising'

Allah made virgins to be lovers and friends to those on his right hand. 56:36-37 Did he!!

Your wives and children are your enemies. They are to you only a temptation. 64:14-15. Horrible!!

Instructions for divorcing your wives. 65:1-6. Read that one. Mr Divine, very enlightened.

Allah's rules for divorcing wives that have not yet reached puberty. 65:4. I wont go their!!

O Prophet! Why bannest thou that which Allah hath made lawful for thee, seeking to please thy wives?"
Allah says it's OK for Muhammad to have sex with any of his wives whenever he wants. 66:1

Muhammad's wives need to be careful. If they criticize their husband, Allah will replace them with better ones. 66:5

Doom is about to fall on all disbelievers. Only worshippers (Muslims) and those who preserve their chastity (except with their wives and slave girls) will be spared from "the fires of hell" that are "eagar to roast." 70:1-30

You don't have to be chaste around your wives or your 'SLAVE' girls. 70:29-30

'SLAVE GIRLS'. Muhammad to have sex with any of his wives whenever 'he' wants. RAPE within marriage. Criticize their husband? Have you realy read Koran, and it's other works Mr Divine?

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:11 — Keith (not verified)

@Dan my point is the local councils, police and government have already allowed that to happen and stood by while they abused the returning soldiers .. As all the police did in Luton and barking was to protect the extreme Muslims when the locals went mad....

Sun, 2011-09-04 20:34 — AdamX (not verified)

The EDL supporters here talk about `muslims` as if the `community` actually exists. It doesnt. Just like there is no white `community.` In the last general election in Whitechapel every single candidate bar a couple, was British bangla. The Green Party had a British bangla candidate, the Tories, Labour, the Liberals, Respect. The sharia heads demanded no one vote...no one took any notice. The very mention of the `muslim community` is racist, prejudice + ignorance.

Wed, 2011-09-07 07:56 — Keith (not verified)

@Mr Devine you may have travelled through Muslim countries met some wonderful people but you miss the point, it's not those type of Muslim people are worried about it's the type who want to convert the country, who wanna protest in disrepectful manner during a minutes silence, or burning poppies, it's getting to much

Sat, 2011-09-03 14:15 — sven king (not verified)

Look there might be some unsavoury elements within the EDL, however the message of Islamic Supremasicm and Intolerance and the spread of Sharia in the west should not forgotten.

We are seeing in the middle east the lack of moral clarity within Islamic countries and one tyrant goes only for another tyrant or Theocractical regime to take it place. The same can be said of Muslims living in the UK. They are very good when in a minority asking for tolerance and special privileges but those same privileges are never found for any minorities groups in any Islamic country, that includes women.

Islam and democracy/ freedom don't mix as Muslims don't respect the laws of the land over the Koran. They believe it is superior but we know it is terrible book that is akin to Mein Kampf.