Peter Oborne vs"that idiot in Brussels"
Watch last night's Newsnight EU row in full.
By George Eaton Published 29 September 2011 12:48A vociferous Peter Oborne ensured that last night's Newsnight was a particularly memorable edition. EU Commission spokesman Amadeu Altafaj-Tardio walked out of the discussion after Oborne repeatedly referred to him as "that idiot in Brussels". Jeremy Paxman, who has been known to sling the odd insult himself, chided the Telegraph columnist for his gratuitous rudeness.
Oborne's view of the euro as an unmitigated disaster is now rarely challenged in the British press (former FT editor and europhile Richard Lambert was trampled by Oborne) . But in last week's New Statesman, Oliver Kamm offered a spirited defence of the single currency, insisting that "the crisis of the euro is severe but there is no reason that it should be terminal."
He added: "Monetary union is not the cause of the crisis. Done properly, it may help insulate member states from disruptive volatility in the international capital markets." You can read his sage analysis in full here.
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37 comments
Oborne typifies the casual xenophobic racist undertones from a defunct imperial power who's day was about 100 years ago. We sadly have come to expect this from a large swathe of the British public who consider themselves middle class, and whose antics will likely find UK thrown out of the EU before too long - Our friends in France and Germany really don't need these kind of nimby hobbits, who think the world owes the some kind of thanks. http://www.grantsforcollege101.com/
The worst thing about the show was not even Oborne but Paxman who did not behave like an unbiased journalist leading a debate should .
Concerning the widespread view in the Anglo-Saxon world of Europe being " in denial" : why are we considered in denial if we criticize for instance downgrades of European countries by rating agencies and is it at the same time OK for the US president to say that ratings don't matter and that the US "will always be a AAA country", why does the CEO of the rating agency that downgraded the US have to resign a few days later ? why is an investigation launched shortly after the downgrade to check the responsibility of the rating agencies in the Subprime Crisis ?
Paxman asked the idiot why the markets were not supporting his optimistic view…I would have returned the question and asked the following question : if really things are so bad in the Euro zone and Armageddon is near, why then has the Euro not collapsed against the Dollar ? Maybe because the market knows that the US is living on credit cards and is in even worse shape…I agree that European leaders have not shown great leadership in this crisis but I’m not impressed either by American style Quantitative Easing policies resulting in the printing of Billions and Billions of dollars..
Why is operation Twist (extension of US debt maturities ) OK when at the same time the rating agencies warned European leaders that extension of the maturity of Greek debt (like proposed in the rescue plan of 21/07) would be seen as a “credit event” and be considered as a default by Greece ?
How can (Anglo-Saxon dominated) financial markets really be taken serious when the CDS market considers a default of France as more probable than a default of countries like Vietnam or Peru ? Why so much fuss about the Euro zone and its “unbearable” debt burden ( 85 % of GDP on average) and so little noise about the US (almost 100 %) and Japan (almost 200 % !) ?
Prat Pete was such a disgrace
The sheer nasty, gratuitous attitude of the thoroughly egregious Oborne is par for the course... Cretins like him rant while the usual bankers, tories, money launderers, Etonians, Sherbornians and generally piss-taking right wing queens mather on about reduced regulation and anti-European debate - beware... the thick deluded right wing loonies are on the march... Get Cable Street prepared...
All that wilol be remembered is that Oborne was rude and fatuous, Tardio dignified and Paxman weak.
Idiot 1-0 Oborne
Serious debate 0-1 Bigotry
Of course those who revel in bigotry will have enjoyed it and feel vindicated and those who want intelligent debate on issues like the Euro will be shaking their heads in despair. The real idiot, Oborne, will hopefully be rewarded by a total drying up of invitations from the serious media, but somehow in our yob-culture, 'Dave-The Chameleon' soundbite and cheap jibe culture, I doubt that.
The Idiot in London.
Peter Oborne should be in forums like Jerry Springer, that seems to be his level of education, but then again, may be Jerry would be quick enough to get rid of him.
I'm reminded of the true story that I think Denis MacShane recounts in his classic book Using the Media.
A member of the National Front and an Archbishop had a TV debate. People rang in to complain that the Archbishop had been far too rude!
Peter Oborne's gratuitous rudeness may have gone well with people who agree with him but does nothing to persuade those who are uncommitted.
Paxo was right to castigate Oborne because oborne was the only idiot n that discussion for his disgraceful behacviour and objectionable views.The man should be banned from the BBC altogether.
Good for Oborne - sometimes idiots need to be identified as such when theur stupidity is endangering the livelihood of others. Europe is a decaying socialist mess and the sooner it is seen for what it is the better
Well that really does just prove everything that is wrong about the attitudes of certain cliques in the British media. Obourne denounces all around him as an idiot, rewrites the past about men like Hague (who was possibly one of the worst Tory leaders) and then proceeds to run a man from the Euro out of the studio, leading to a 1 side, shoddy debate.
Paxman should've acted quicker to get him on message. Ridiculous.
The Euro is doing what it was designed to - it was only ever a neo-liberal project and the purging of the public sector, the theft of state assets in sell-offs and rip-offs is proceeding apace. Job done as far as Baroso is concerned.
In defence of Oborne the guy in Brussels is just in complete and utter denial. What he was saying went beyong optimism and into fantasy. It would be interesting to know if he himself has convinced himself of the lies he was saying or is just forced to say that as it is his job.
The real issue is that politicians in Europe are trying to delay the problem and probable collapse of the Euro so it does not seemingly happen on their watch.
I blame Paxman, if he was a referee he should have banished himself to the dressing room, he allowed this dickhead Osborne to dictate the debate, irrespective of Osborne's argument (which I disagree with) he should show respect.
Oborne was right to repeatedly call him an idiot, that Brussels federalist guy was talking absolute nonsense.
Listen to what he was actually saying. Its beyond stupid.
'The Idiot' wanted full union because his own nation has failed and he personally wants more power, cash and gravitas.
Davyh
I guess you won't be voting for the Tories when you graduate from 6th form.
Oborne behaved like a prick.
And for the most part Paxman allowed him to.
He pulled his stunt on Lambert too, giving him a copy of Guilty Men.
Lambert got the better of him.
Fuck him and his white socks.
I am neither pro nor against the euro. And despite his politics, I have always thought Oborne to be a principled journalist, quick to criticise the tories as much as he does Labour. But his rabid and rude performance last night was most embarrassing and does himself a disservice.
Typical CONservative arrogance from Peter O'bore.
Is "Yaboo!!!, shout down your opponent" a debating technique taught at private schools?
It seems to be populat with CONservatives and its supporters.
I was going to say something witty, but there is no point. Oborne typifies the casual xenophobic racist undertones from a defunct imperial power who's day was about 100 years ago. We sadly have come to expect this from a large swathe of the british public who consider themselves middle class, and whose antics will likely find UK thrown out of the EU before too long - Our friends in France and Germany really don't need these kind of nimby hobbits, who think the world owes the some kind of thanks.
Three cheers for Oborne.
A spade is a spade... an idiot is an idiot... time someone said so.
Lambert = "that idiot in London" !
All Oborne has done is to demonstrate that Xenophobia is still alive and well in the right wing press.
Neither of the pound, the dollar or the euro is having their finest hour in world markets.
I'd rather be rude than an idiot.
Oborne typifies the 'arrogant ignorance' of public school/Oxbridge boyz(sic).
He cannot engage in genuine debate; he cannot weigh evidence; he cannot intellectually engage with opposing viewpoints, let alone analyses.
His style is febrile and puerile. His soi-disant documentaries are ill-disguised rants and degradation of serious documentary. His performances are preening and self-promoting (the slapping of his obscenely-titled pamphlet on the table in front of Lambert). Everytime I have read or seen his 'output' I feel he has done incalculable damage to the cause he espouses by his sloppy methodology, his inability to engage with any facts or analyses that don't fit his mission, his unconcealed contempt for those who fail to 'worship' his insights.
He really 'believes' that he alone knows and speaks the truth.
In fact he is just a nasty boy who has never developed beyond the public school VIth style of 'debate.'
I am shocked that any human blessed with cognition could still, in the face of cataclysmic economic destruction, believe that the EU and the Euro are good things in need of support.
Like those who deny the holocaust and those who deny that climate has ever changed until we burned a bit of carbon, these economic reality deniers are delusional beyond belief.
I would not normally have inclination to mind. People are free to believe whatever nonsense they like in a free society, but their hubristic delusions have rendered a disaster upon millions and are on the verge of creating a single political, economic and fiscal dictatorship which is the opposite of a free society. Democracy is literally in it's death throws throughout the Eurozone with the inevitable impact that will have on the whole of the EU, we MUST be granted a binding referendum on membership, before our English law becomes a mere reference in a history book.
"Fuck him and his white socks." Sweet.
By the way, nobody, and I mean nobody, understands macroeconomics, hasn't anyone realised that yet? Ergo anyone calling anyone else an idiot for having a differing opinion is, well, a prick in white socks.
@scandalousbill
"Neither of the pound, the dollar or the euro is having their finest hour in world markets."
What a terrible eductation system we have here. I blame the last Labour government more than the "right wing press".
Depressing
Heavy lidded, dishevilled looking, giggling like a 12 year old while someone else was talking and able to offer nothing but gratuitous abuse when it was his turn to speak. Anyone else think Oborned seemed a tad 'tired and emotional' last night?
I don't think it was Paxman's finest hour either, locking the stable door after the EU Commissioner had bolted.
Maria, Oborne has been articulately debating the fine details and merits and lack thereof of the Euro for a couple of decades now. In response he, and those who agree with the sceptical and realist argument regarding the unsustainability of the euro have been continuously met, not with reasoned argument or even rational cognition, but with knee-jerk insults like "little Englander", "xenophobe", and "racist nutter". Now that we, on the reality side of the argument, have painfully been proven right, again those in opposition fall back on, "In fact he is just a nasty boy who has never developed beyond the public school VIth style of 'debate.'" instead of facing reality.
All we get is insults and denial and you wonder why we revert also to insults out of frustration? The Europhiles have led this continent to the edge of a catastrophic cliff and now they think that the answer to the catastrophe is to drive full speed over the edge of it!
Oborne may have been insulting, but he was also passionately truthful and correct. I find the fact that these idealistic, foolish and delusional Europhiles have driven this continent to the very edge of economic destruction to be far more gratuitously offensive, and idiotic, than listening to a man proved right by events to be truthfully calling an idiot, an idiot.
"eductation system"
Pot. Kettle. Black.
I like a lot of Oborne's work, but that was pretty poor last night. The arguments we hear these days in defense of the single currency can be easily and very elegantly ripped apart, it's frankly idiotic when given just such an opportunity, to behave as Oborne did.
Oborne, what a pratt - and what a pig-ignorant performance.
Paxman, you utterly wasted my time. I expected a debate and all I got were the rantings of a fishhusband.
Sorry - prat.
Pratt is ignorant but not pig-ignorant.
Resorting to insult undermines any sensible argument, did himself a disservice. Poor.
Oborne had a golden opportunity on Newsnight, as he did with his Blair doc, but managed to come across as a prat in both. His Blair efforts were poorly researched backed by poor analysis and delivery, his Newsnight appearance was embarrassing. Is he as close to retirement as he appears?
' "I'm Peter Oborne" ' !
If that IDIOT in Brussels had a worthy case he would have stood his ground. Instead he threw his toys out of the pram! Loved it!!
I`ve liked some of the stuff Oborne has done in the past, even though he was a Tory!, but his actions on Newsnight made him look a complete, pompous, pratt!!, he shuffled around grinning in his chair like a petulant little attention seeker, shouting over everybody, his rudeness to the guy from europe and Lambert was pathetic at best!, it was bordering on being very infantile!, you almost expected him to start pulling tongues and blow rasperries at them?, very childish for a person in his position!, and personified himself like a typical xenaphobic, obnoxious right wing Tory!, What a pratt!!.