Should society let uninsured people die? "YEAH!"
Crowd at Monday night's Republican presidential debate cheer at suggestion that society should allow the uninsured to die.
By Samira Shackle Published 14 September 2011 10:09
Once again, one of the most memorable moments in Monday's CNN Republican presidential debate came from the audience. Hot on the heels of jubilant cheers at Rick Perry's record number of executions as Texas governor in last week's debate, some members of the audience cheered at the suggestion that society should allow uninsured Americans to die.
The host Wolf Blitzer was pushing candidate Ron Paul about a hypothetical man without insurance who goes into a coma. "That's what's freedom is all about," replied Paul. "Are you saying society should just let him die?" asked Blizter -- at which point several members of the Tea Part-heavy audience interrupted with "YEAH!"
None of the candidates took issue with the cheers, although it has been reported that Perry said he was "taken aback" by the response, adding "we are the party of life".
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34 comments
Sean, so you are black, which is irrelevant to the question of why would you call Obama a fascist. It is an absurd label.
Calling some one "ignorant Brit" is also hilarious, coming from a citizen from a nation who elected George Bush,a complete imbecile, to the White House and made America the laughing stock of the world.
At least Obama is an intelligent and knowledgeable man, which is a big improvement.
Daniele, "you are stalking me now" Daniele. Don't flatter yourself love!! and 'NO' I'm not a Christian but whats wrong with Christians? As for bile you really should re-read your own utterance's. Daniele, could you possibly imagine the humongous cost in the United States of providing free universal health care for such and obese nations, there's not even enough money in China, to pay for Obama's healthcare proposals.
Daniele. I'm not stalking you honest!! But did you see David Cameron been hailed a hero in Tripoli by Libyan doctor's and nurses. Ouch that most hurt!!
Stop wasting your money on wars (and stop eating so much)
Oh !!.. AND start taxing the filthy rich! And put a stop to the bankers' obscene bonuses and tax the banks instead.
You might find you've got some spare cash to help the vulnerable.
It is amazing that when there are economic problems, the first people you think of punishing are the poor and the sick.
Cutting your gigantic defence budget and making the rich contribute more doesn't even cross your mind.
Daniele's unfounded, judgmental bias is clear and apparent. Ron Paul is a man of Peace. He believes in cutting the MILITARY budget, and bringing home all of the troops, from all of the bases around the world. Only declarations of war will warrant any military involvement. This will include humanitarian missions too. The US can't afford it anymore.
Not everyone wants to live on the Government drip. Hyper nationalism mixed with a merger of state and corporations was a concept of Mussolini's called fascism... you cow. There is a problem with Government and Military personnel getting preferential treatment with benefits with an expense to the tax payer. It should stop.
So if your health care is so great, why do the English have such awful teeth. If your education is so top notch why are the World's best colleges in the U.S.? When foreigners visit your country, you are rude. When people visit here, we are not. You have no class.
P.S.- Your people have inflicted more hate and selfishness on the World, than any other group of people.
Should society let 'irresponsible people die? "YEAH!" That is what was said? Ron Paul is probably one of the best politicians in the United States. I would vote for him.
Danielle is a PIG. Don't visit London!! your quite right, it's full of third world immigrants and rude Londoners. Your also right about NHS dentistry, it's awful, that's why most pay privately. But as for the general NHS, thats FANTASTIC. 'well' it would be, but for the likes of the
Danielle in this country, that think half the world and his dog are entitled to free publicly founded health prevision, they themselves have paid nothing. Isn't that right Danielle?
Luddite, you are stalking me now, so much you have to write twice to hide your obsession with people like me.
I have contributed to the welfare state of this country all my life by paying all my taxes and all my dues , unlike the filthy rich,and has taken no benefit in return apart from the use of the NHS. So why don't you stop insulting people you know nothing about?
You are seriously losing it Luddite that you now seem to result to personal insults on every issue instead of arguing your case.
And if you hate Britain so much, why do you bother reading a British magazine? Please don't visit here either. I went to the States once, that was enough for me.
Talking about rudeness, the American customs are a bloody nightmare, they all make you feel like criminals and you are as welcome there as a leper in a holiday resort.And the Americans are the rudest tourists in Europe, everybody will tell you.
Luddite, you should seek help. There is so much bile in your heart that one day you are going to choke on it.
I bet you describe yourself as a Christian.
I lived in the US for six years and found that even if you have insurance it does not equal care. Twice I was hurt on the job and twice my treatment cost were refused by my personal carrier and my employers. I was not the only one, two people I knew had the same problem.
...which of course means that a very ill, uninsured pregnant woman under a Teapot president would be left to die; but they would do all they could to save the unborn child (right to life etc.), who would then be left to fend for itself. Nice one!
It is beyond disturbing that a mainstream political party can attract supporters who boisterously cheer on the notion of someone being allowed to die by a community that only sees value in money and contracts.
No doubt some free knucklehead will come on and defend that heartless, dead-eyed principle.
Should be 'free market knucklehead' - why is there no edit function?
Absolutely appalling behaviour from these Tea Party fanatics. Its a pity that none of the contenders didn't challenge the few that cheered.
Of course society can't let people die because they are not insured.
This is why Obama's Welfare Reforms are so important in helping America's poor.
Bear in mind, hypothetically the US would never be allowed to join the EU given its record on numerous human rights issues alone.
A state which cannot or refuse to take care of its vulnerable members is not a civilised state. It is the mark of an uncivilised society.
Even the cruel Romans did it as well as all the ancient civilisations.
Wolves do it as well as many other animal societies.
It is indicative that the Americans describe their society as CHRISTIAN!
Jesus must be turning in his grave (that is if he is still in one of course). I have always been told that to be a Christian was first and foremost to be concerned with helping the weak and defenceless.
Also it appears that the American notion of freedom is simply "freedom to die" for the poor and "freedom to do what the f..k you like" for the rich.real freedom isn't that.
Appalling but not surprising.
I had 2 Americans for dinner the other night.They shake their head at the immorality and craziness of their country and live in Europe.
Remember the NHS has the Liverpool pathway to death, where people are euthansed, and nurses with "do not disturb" signs. Not much compassion there.
The answer from Ron Paul was that he would advise someone to take out health insurance but not *force* them to do so. That is what individual liberty is all about: organising on the indvididual level, not the collective, state organised level. The state organised level requires Prior to socialised health care, doctors and hospitals treated people on a pro bono work and there were charitable organisations. Socialised methods are inherently coercive, both by forcing people to take out medical insurance and by funding it through confiscation of peoples' wealth through the tax system.
I wanted to make a comment about this, but don't know what to say. How can these people who claim to be Christians be so heartless? Would they feel the same way if a member of their own family were in this position? I'm just glad I don't live in America, although our current government's policies may be heading in a similar direction of not caring about the vulnerable.
It is appalling that we have reduced health care to an arithmetic sum in America. It's equally appalling that we refuse to acknowledge this and instead continue to address it in ideological terms. Maybe if we were straightforward in our dialogue we might change our outcomes.
The New York Times reported in 2009 that 18,000 Americans die annually because they can't afford health insurance, one every thirty minutes.
The "Land of the Free" is the antithesis of Christ's commandments to assist the poor and vulnerable as its appalling record on poverty and social deprivation show.
Sometimes I wish there was a hell where those repellent excuses for humanity, the Tea Party and their ilk, would end up.
It is sad to see the lack of journalism in this article. If you saw this debate, it is nothing like what is described in this article. Ron Paul clearly says no to the question and goes on to describe how he worked in a church hospital and helped the poor and the uninsured. The media's attempt to marginalize a bunch of individuals and label them is wrong. It is the greedy corporations who spin all of these articles, because they know the individuals who represent the "Tea Party" if they got into power the status quo would change. The present administration is run by banksters, lobbyists, war mongers and thieves.
People who believe in liberty,freedom, and self reliance should have leaders who do too. Obama is a fascist(corporatist). He believes in controlling all aspects of life and merging the corporate with the state. Sick!
These people are a danger to our society, everyone has a right to live rich or poor. These are the same christian religious fanatics who are appalled by someone having an abortion but yet cheer when they want people who can't afford health care insurance to die.
Wow. This attitude, taken with the support of the death penalty demonstrates the little regard republicans have for human life. It seems therefore that the only reason why they can, at the same time, be so against abortion is that they see every human foetus as a potential medical insurance customer.
@Sean
When you say Obama is a fascist, do you really mean to say "the President is near...?"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vcZ9ku_wInw
So Sean, you don't mind helping the poor if it is just charity, preferably through a church hospital.What is wrong with properly organised "social security" where the rich can't choose who deserve their charity?
Yes so Ron Paul was at least willing to help the poor. What about those who shouted "YEAH!" as an answer to the question? The media didn't invent that.
What is your point anyway? Obama is a fascist? where are going with that? Let me guess, you are American? Only an American would brand Obama a "fascist". Sometimes he is a "communist" because you guys can't make up your mind what sounds worse and you can't even tell the difference.
The only thing I would agree with you is "The present administration is run by banksters, lobbyists, war mongers and thieves". But I would get ride of the word "present".All
American governments have been run by those guys for decades. Why are you singling out this administration?
What is different about Obama, apart from the obvious?
The only thing we can say about Obama is that he has been unable to change the system and nothing has changed.So much for his campaign slogan. It rings really hollow now.
But the Republicans, especially the Tea-party people are beyond the pale.
Good point Mike.
"jubilant cheers" at the record number of executions!! Executions actually make them happy??!!I assume they would also cheer if another doctor had been murdered for performing an abortion.
"Sick bastards" is the label which comes to mind and no, Sean, I don't see anything wrong with that.
The moral is, you will never win the argument until you learn to get the wording of the question right.
Wow! What assumptions you make. I am black, you ignorant Brit!
“People who believe in liberty, freedom, and self reliance should have leaders who do too.”
Do the freedom-loving people want to bestow the freedom on their healthy and well-educated children? The US is consumed by "Defense" spending (should be "Aggression" spending) which treats their employees in the perfectly socialist ways: with health insurance, pensions, and such. Where is your roar, Sean?
To be fair, Ron Paul as a Doctor sounded repulsed and taken aback by this........ which was shouted out by a couple of mindless dicks who got shunted to the side by the rest of the audience.
The Republican Party is not an extreme party. The Republican Party is the party of peace and life and hope.
Sean: What on Earth are you talking about? There are some "death wards" in the NHS hospitals?? Who on earth told you that? This is pure fantasy or just pure lies. Maybe you've seen too many science fiction movies.
Unbelievable! and you call the Brits ignorant!
So "socialised methods are inherently coercive" ? you mean organised society where everyone is taken care of and where the old concept of charity is efficiently organised so no one is left out, is repulsive to you? Why is it you prefer badly organised and random "charity"? Does that make you feel good? is that it?"socialised" seems to be such a dirty word for you. All that word means is that it is "organised" by all the members of that society for the good of all. there is really nothing sinister about the idea of "society" is there?
Anyway in Britain,nobody forces you to use the NHS or to have a health insurance. You can just walk in a ridiculously expensive private hospital and pay for your care if you want to. You just talk complete nonsense.
Yes what a marvellous system in the US! When you need to claim from your insurance,(like Matty) they can just refuse to pay. terrific! And they won't insure people or children with chronic illnesses. Do these people deserve to die as well?
Beggers belief. The same people that cheer for the death of the uninsured poor are those who call for the death of doctors that perform abortions. Nutters all.
So one nut-job in an audience of Tea Party members wrote your headline? No one is surprised. The correct answer is: If one chooses not to be pay for health insurance then they should be responsible for the cost of their intermittent care.
" the republican party is the party of peace and life and hope".
Go and say that to the thousands Iraqi and Afghan families who grieve for their lost ones through murderous wars started by Republican presidents.
Which planet do you live on?
Mark:
Did it ever cross your little mind that some people are just not paid enough to afford private health insurance. It isn't a bloody choice is it?
I've never been so shocked than when I saw an ordinary well spoken guy begging in Los Angeles. He needed money for his wife's cancer treatment and he just hadn't enough. She was going to die for certain without it. This is something that would shock the most right wing European. It is just obscene that people are dying because they are poor. Only Americans find this situation tolerable.
Maria: you are right about "aggression spending". I have heard recently that America didn't have enough skilled people to do the jobs required. The education system was so bad that they had to recruit abroad. And it is getting worse.
I suppose according to the same logic, if you can't pay, your kid can stay illiterate.
"land of freedom" indeed.
Stop thinking with your heart and use your brain for a moment, we can't keep borrowing from the Chinese to continue this all you can eat buffet of benefits! At some stage debt markets will stop lending to America and your entitlement system will be gone, weather or not it's fair or just. Open a history book and look at what happened to Rome; crumbling infrastructure, declining currency, wars around the world and free entitlement programs....will all lead to the fall of the USA I'm afraid.
@Sean
I apologise if I've offended you, it just seems to me that when people accuse Obama of being a fascist or a socialist, they are generally using these words as ciphers, also I must point out that I'm not actually a Brit, I'm Hong Kong Chinese. In other words we all all make assumptions...
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