Enter your email address here to receive updates from the team.
Iran Watch, part 6.
Tags: Iran Watch media Israel Nuclear Iran
Yes, theoretically, anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism are 2 distinct issues. I am saying that any criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic. However, current anti-Zionism is, indeed, more often than not, rooted in anti-Semitism.
Jeremy, to be fair, JJ did not criticize you on the basis of "dual loyalty". Rather, he said that you can be criticized by the likes of Mariella. I copied and pasted the relevant quote: "You claim you have 'dual citizenship'. You need to be more careful because Mariella etc . will claim that you have dual loyalties.". Just to remove a possible misunderstanding, this is all.
If only I could be as clever as you. Prixx
What case are you making Mariella you Idiot, because he speaks factually and truthfully about Islam and Muslims makes what he say incorrect? Dont think so, the world knows Islam is violent and hateful.
Jews are the Chosen People, as deemed by God. The Jewish religion is superior to all others Christianity and Islam. If everybody converted to Judaism, they could be as successful as the Jews worldwide. Never mind learning a lot, it is because of Israel that the world is what it is. The world has nothing to teach Israel; Israel has everything to teach the world. The Christians are too weak and do not understand the meaning of success.
Sorry, I meant to say - 'I am NOT saying that any criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic".
Unfortunately, this does not seem to be the case, yesboy.
Where are Sir Michael and Jankaas by the way?
Is Arminius going to show up?
To use your example, nobody constantly threatens the non-Israeli Palestine or Lebanon or any other country in the world, except for Israel, with annihilation. This is the difference.
With respect to the existential threat, this is not an issue of Western guilt, this is irrelevant, especially since it does not appear that there is much of this guilt that still remains. It is an issue of Iran's ability to inflict serious damage on Israel. Israel is a very small country, and a nuclear strike will really cripple it. Yes, it is possible to retaliate later on, but this will not change the fact that it will be crippled. As one of the articles I have adduced shows, nuclear weapons is a great equalizer, this is one of the differences between nuclear weapons and conventional weapons. Please also note that, as I have shown, Iran has already threaten to obliterate Israel in a pre-emptive nuclear attack.
Incidentally, as I have also pointed out, it is not only Israel and the West that do not Want Iran not to have nuclear weapons. It is also counties like Russia, Persian Gulf countries, and others.
MJ Rosenberg: why he is trying to stop the next war
by Philip Weiss on March 12, 2012 38
MJ Rosenberg says he won't be using the term Israel Firster but it was an effective tool in the work to stop a war on Iran.
It has proven to be a distraction, allowing the pro-war lobby to focus on my choice of words rather than the substance of my arguments. I will not be using it again, for many reasons including the fact that some good people were genuinely offended by it. That was not my intention. My intention is to focus like the proverbial laser on the threat posed by war with Iran and the 45 year occupation.
Perhaps I feel that threat more than some. My wife was born in a Displaced Persons camp in Germany to Polish Jews who survived the Holocaust. Many in the family didn't including my wife's uncle, for whom our oldest son is named, who was caught by the Nazis putting up posters in Warsaw urging resistance. He was gassed in Maidanek along with his young sister, just engaged to be married. They were both Zionists who dreamed of living in Israel. How amazed and happy they would be to know that a vibrant Israel exists. How horrified they would be to know that its existence is jeopardized by an unnecessary war, one that can be avoided by diplomacy....
My message is this.
Many of the same people who pushed us into Iraq are doing the same thing with Iran. They are pressuring Congress to prevent the president of the United States from negotiating with the Iranian government. They are banning diplomatic contacts.
Alexander, I want to return to the two claims you made, which rather got lost in the increasingly predictable (and extensive!) Israel/Palestine arguments on any thread dealing with the region: that Rafsanjani advocated using nuclear weapons against Israel in the past, and that he “has just been appointed to one of the highest positions in Iran”.
First things first: in the quote you provided I can’t find any call to use nuclear weapons on Israel at all. In fact, he was expounding the theory of mutually-assured destruction: "If a day comes when the world of Islam is duly equipped with the arms Israel has in possession, the strategy of colonialism would face a STALEMATE because application of an atomic bomb would not leave any thing in Israel but the same thing would just produce damages in the Muslim world" (my emphasis). What exactly have you been reading into this text, which is simply a logical statement?
Secondly, Rafsanjani has not “just been appointed”; he has in fact been the Chairman of the Expediency Council since 1989, and has just been reappointed for the next five years. Hardly a big change there, then. I hope you weren’t trying to whip up a controversy on baseless grounds?
Freddie, for your information I am not even religious, so this whole notion of "Chosen People", weak Christians, etc, is completely inapposite here. The thing is that whether one is Jewish, Christian, Muslim, or Buddhist, one who is objective will have to admit that Israel has achieved great successes under very difficult conditions. Please do not ascribe to me the thinking that I do not espouse and have not expressed. Incidentally, the thought about jealousy did not come from me but from Prince Philip.
"The Ashkenazy peoples, long known as a dominating, manipulative force in the region, adopted Judaism between 900-1000 AD and have been using it to astonishing achievement ever since" Certainly, this is not anti-Semitic in any way. Oh no. It is only anti-Zionist, of course. You have exposed yourself completely, pal.
All of this has been documented for centuries and there are vast numbers of articles and papers on this issue online. Here now, are a few emails from people, Jews and Christians and others, who are outraged at Zionist efforts to dominate by intimidation and threat...especially in trying to label this site as 'anti-Semitic' and 'racist', etc.
If one wants to see racism, one needs look no farther that the racist, apartheid nation of Zionist Israel and its treatment of the Palestinian people...topped off with the building of the WALL. That huge numbers of Jews have recently fled Israel is a well-kept secret. We are informed there are long lists of Israelis trying to gain passports to get out. And then there are the heroic Jews who reject Zionism completely...and one need look no farther than the Israeli Army 'Refuseniks' to find examples of noble Jews who have decided to say 'NO' to their Zionist controllers. And then there are enlightened Jewish organisations like 'Jews Against Zionism' who speak out against the status quo and seek to inform the world that not all Jews approve of the policies of the current regime in Israel.
18 March 2012 at 13:26
Yes, theoretically, anti-Zionism and anti-Semitism are 2 distinct issues. I am saying that any criticism of Israel is anti-Semitic. However, current anti-Zionism is, indeed, more often than not, rooted in anti-Semitism.
Yes, Terry, indeed. I am a member of both BNP and EDL. Not only this, but I also belong to the Illuminati, Trilateral Commission, and the Council on Foreign Relations. And do not forget my membership in the Bilderberg Group. In addition, I am one of the Elders of Zion, moreover, one of the eldest ones. Well, you are fully informed now.
First things first, you have no manners and use the most ugliest of language when you refer to your opponents, calling me an idiot on this occasion but using far worse language at other times. Spencer has a clear agenda@ to demonise Islam and its followers. I guess the world which you live, Muslim hating is a pastime. I believe in the past the same sort of religious bashing was aimed at the Jews. So it is OK for you to disrespect Muslims, but if I criticise Israel I am anti semitic or racist.
As for Islam being violent and hateful, I think you are looking in the mirror at yourself.
Man up you thicko. Go and put your shxx somewhere else
You can provide as many facts as you like. Alexander will never accept any information which does not confirm his own view of the world.
JStreet are a powerful force and anti dote to the AIPAC group. Their support among Jews is growing. JJ is a demagogue who cannot tolerate dissent. Dual loyalty is a hot political potato in the firster movement. Trust me JJ you need to grow up. All you are doing is fuelling hatred for Israel. You seem to have a pattern of trashing anyone who does not agree with you. It is so ugly. Some of the trash written on this comments page by those who claim to suport Israel is right down there in the gutter.
US, Israel agree Iran abandoned nuclear bomb’
By wmw_admin on March 18, 2012
JPOST.com Staff – March 18, 2012
US and Israeli intelligence agencies mostly agree that Iran has not restarted its development of a nuclear bomb, the New York Times reported on Saturday.
According to the report, the assessment among top US officials is that Iran has not yet decided to pursue a nuclear weapon, a conclusion which was established based on intelligence analyses.
Israel – while seeing an existential threat in Iran’s possible pursuit of a nuclear bomb – mostly agrees with those assessments, a US intelligence official speaking on the condition of anonymity told the Times.
“Their people ask very hard questions, but Mossad does not disagree with the US on the weapons program,” the Times quoted the official as saying.
Still, the report notes that the US has had difficulty formulating a complete picture of Iran’s nuclear agenda, which intelligence officials said is due to the inability of the CIA to work effectively on the ground in Iran.
The US has been “virtually blind on the ground” in Iran since the hostage crisis over three decades forced the US to shutter its embassy in Tehran.
The available evidence the US has gathered is often outdated and incomplete, and provides more information about what Iran is not doing, the Times reported.
Recruiting spies has been particularly problematic, with the report noting a 2004 technical mistake that put a network of Iranian agents in jeopardy, and the doubtful testimony of an Iranian scientist who defected to the US, only to return to Iran claiming he was abducted by the CIA.
While the US and Israel share information on Iran, the US is reticent to accept intelligence Israel has gathered from the Iranian exile group the Mujahedeen Khalq (MEK), which the US considers a terrorist organization.
That hesitation stems from US experience in dealing with an Iraqi exile group, the Iraqi National Congress, which provided faulty intelligence on Iraq’s weapons program that led to the US invasion of Iraq in 2003.
The US prefers a method of wire tapping of Iranian officials, which helped the US in its 2005 assessment that Iran had abandoned its nuclear program in 2003.
While Iran maintains that its nuclear program is for civilian purposes, and has indicated willingness to engage with the international community over its nuclear program, US President Barack Obama warned last week that the window for diplomacy is closing.
US intelligence officials concluded that the evidence that Supreme Leader Ayatollah Ali Khamenei had called off the nuclear program was “too hard to ignore,” a conclusion that still “holds up really well,” according to the report.
Yoh!! YoH! Brov. My man. you is really banging. Bilderberg my axxe. It is obvious you are a tired old has been who has done nothing of great significance in life. SO when all is said and done, your only comfort in life is to post 24/7 on NS. I is well jealous my man.
Jeremy, again, you seemed to be ignoring my point that JJ did not accuse you of "dual loyalty". JUst look at his message. Of course, you can disagree with him, but, at least, please state his position accurately.
"The Ashkenazy peoples, long known as a dominating, manipulative force in the region," Certainly, this is not anti-Semitic. Oh no. Only anti-Zionist. You have exposed yourself completely, pal.
I can tell you are a man of influence. You got so much power, you don't knwo what to do with it. So many friends that you have to turn them away. You got so much time to speak to me.
I am, actually, glad to be on this page. Learning new debating skills all the time.
sorry Mehdi, always love your articles but this is getting a bit boring now.
Rentoul doesn't deserve that much attention, when did his views matter anyway. The guy is dangerously ignorant and an idiot, though most "bomb iran camp" are not idiots but definitely dangerously ignorant.
@Mariella: Remember how in one of your previous rants you invoked your hero the odious Atzmon? Don't deny it, because you did.
Well, it seems that the antisemitic creep Atzmon has annoyed some people in the Palestinian camp (inc. Omar Barghuti) who now refuse to have anything to do with him:
So, Mariella, how does it feel to be a supporter of a Judeophobe, not just an Anti-Zionist but a Jew hater?
DON'T BOTHER REPLYING BECAUSE YOU HAVE LOST THE ARGUMENT AND I REST MY CASE!!! OMG!
seems like you've not been following, now 6 articles by Mehdi, about the level of threat posed by Iran.
He doesnt exactly write original material but what he does do is highlight what, those who know anything about this issue say about the level of threat.
I dont see how you can be more authoritative on this issue than Mossd cheifs, US secret service intelligence officials and many more.
what you say about what he says about what they want to do to Iran really is not important.
Knowing what you know is just as important as knowing what you dont know.
you seem to be advocating bombing Iran on the basis that we dont know Iran is developing nuclear weapon.
that maybe a formula by which Israel wants to pursue its foreign policy but its hardly one that you can call civilised.
The Jewish people are superior to all other peoples and this is why God called them the chosen people. Any successes In Israel is down to this very fact. Jews made the world a success. Christians, Muslims, Atheists, Agnostics, Buddhists need to submit to the forces of the Holy Book and convert now. It is the only way.
Who the fxxk are you to give me orders. Is it hardening up down there
Some similarities between Mariella's writing style and Mehdi's:
Mariella's use of 'END OF', 'LOL' and Mehdi's use of 'BOR-RING' in his piece either means that Mehdi is Mariella or it means that Mehdi is having a laugh.
Either way, it's sad.
First, Olijaan, please indicate where Rafsanjani said that Iran's use of nuclear weapons will only be defensive in case of its use by Israel against Iran. It is nowhere to be found. This being the case, there are good reasons to interpret this as a threat of an offensive use of nuclear weapons in a preemptive strike. Please also consider this comment from a news report where I read about this statement:
"Observing that despite the fact that Israel is believed to have more than one hundred atomic warheads and the necessary technology to transport them to the very heart of Iran and elsewhere, but no Israeli official nor any newspaper have ever raised the slightest possibility of an atomic threat, "even in defence of their very existence", Mr. Salamatian wondered the reasons behind Mr. Hashemi-Rafsanjani’s declaration, which he said should be taken seriously "considering the rank of the man who pronounced it".
Also, whether Rafsanajani has been appointed or re-appointed, does not really matter, since it shows that his position has not been repudiated and he continues to enjoy high authority in Iran. This, coupled with his statement about the use of nuclear weapons, makes one worried, indeed.
Audio hostem. Auribus teneo lupum
If Iran only wants to pursue peaceful nuclear technology, as it says, why wouldn't it just stop any efforts of further uranium enrichment and submit itself to international inspections? Everybody knows that Iran is lying.
Wagwam, wagwam, my man. Yo, Yo. You is wasting time man. Hey I thought you was busy, busy man. Memba me tel u
It is obvious that the plight of Israel is Alexander's central and only pre-occupation.
He has zero concern about the nuclear fall out from an Israeli attack on the various nuclear sites in Iran.
I am not giving you any orders, yesboy.
Mariella. you are an Idiot. Lets look at a recent blog by Robert Spencers on jihad watch....Now this story is shocking a 16yr old who kills herself because she was forced to marry her rapist. This is carried out under Islam - isnt it a shocking story? She is not the only one, why should the world not be able to understand what happens in the name of ISlam??? Should we be silent? So Robert Spencer and Myself are demonizing Islam for reporting about a factual story? How can we report this story without bringing up Islam???? Tell me???? It is Islam that has caused this girl to kill herself...what a wicked law making her marry her Rapist...its SICK.
This is different from the lies and mistruths, the conjecture and leftY and Islamic appraisal of Israel that is SO biased, slanted and untrue. Israel isnt perfect, it doesn't do everything right, but it wants peace but Muslims will keep finding one excuse after the next to try to destroy it - because YOU ARE ALL JEALOUS OF ITS SUCCESS.
16-year-old Moroccan girl kills herself after judge forces her to marry her rapist
This is done because the focus in Islam is not on the rape at all, but on the shame the woman has brought to her family by her sexual immorality, even if she was forced. That shame is erased if the rapist marries her. "Moroccan girl, 16, kills herself after judge forced her to marry man who RAPED her," by Lee Moran in the Daily Mail, March 14 (thanks to David):
A Moroccan teenager killed herself after a judge forced her to marry her rapist.
The 16-year-old girl, named only as Amina, ate rat poison after a Tangier court which was supposed to be punishing her 26-year-old attacker decided that they should instead be wed.
This is because Moroccan laws exempt a rapist from punishment if he agrees to marry his victim.
Traumatised by the rape and the forced marriage, Moroccan newspaper al-Massae said she committed suicide at her husband's house.
Hafida Elbaz, director of the Women’s Solidarity Association, criticised the law and said rapists often believed they could avoid punishment by marrying their victims.
The incident throws more light on the way women are treated in Islamic countries.
Last year Afghan 21-year-old Gulnaz was jailed for 'adultery by force' after she was brutally raped by her husband's cousin.
Her attacker was jailed for seven years for the crime that left her pregnant.
A global outrage saw the President of Afghanistan personally pardoning her and releasing her from Kabul's Badam Bagh jail, with no pre-conditions.
OK, find comfort in your own words. Obviously, you need it.
There you have it. COnfirmed at 1547. Alexander is not interested in hearing any other point of view but his own. Olijaan has presented a reasonable narrative on Iran and yet Alexander knows best.
@Jeremy " I do think that whenever the holocaust is mentioned people think only of the Jews and it is Jewish suffering that counts the most. "
For what it's worth, I find it embarrassing sometimes when Jewish people bring up the Holocaust because it can be perceived as self-centred and oblivious to other groups' suffering.
But the world 'holocaust' has come to mean - does mean - the Jewish nightmare of the 1940s in Europe. It doesn't mean other groups (Armenians, former Yugoslavia) didn't suffer appalingly, but the world at large doesn't have specific words for them, although they must exist (I assume) for the peoples who went through their own holocausts.
If only thoese pesky Palestinians would just move over to Jordan, the problem would be solved. The Palestinians are nothing but imposters. They should just let the Israelis get on with taking their land. WHo are Palestinians. Poor Israel, the rubbish she has to put up with is reason enough to nuke the Arabs and Iranians put together. I think the Middle East needs Israel to keep it in check. Fairs, fair, we was there first. Might is right and that is the end of it. That is what my teacher taught me in school. I love AMerica as much as I love Israel.
To sum up the conflict in Israel, if Muslims laid down there arms today, there would be peace in Israel. If Israel laid down its arms today, there would be no more Israel.
I can see that you are trying to be rational Pete Parkour and agree with your second paragraph. I could have a sensible debate with someone like you.
(From the New York Times: U.S. Backers of Israel Pressure Obama Over Policy on Iran)
While defenders of Israel rally every year at the meeting of the pro-Israel lobbying group, the American Israel Public Affairs Committee, this year’s gathering has been supercharged by a convergence of election-year politics, a deepening nuclear showdown and the often-fraught relationship between the president and the Israeli prime minister. Mr. Obama and Mr. Netanyahu will both speak to the group, known as Aipac, as will the three leading Republican presidential candidates, who will appear via satellite from the campaign trail on the morning of Super Tuesday. Republicans have seized on Iran’s nuclear ambitions to accuse Mr. Obama of being weak in backing a staunch ally and in confronting a bitter foe.
The pressure from an often-hostile Congress is also mounting. A group of influential senators, fresh from a meeting with Mr. Netanyahu in Jerusalem, has called on Mr. Obama to lay down sharper criteria, known as “red lines,” about when to act against Iran’s nuclear ambitions.
To counter Aipac’s message, J Street has circulated a video on Capitol Hill, highlighting American and Israeli military experts who have voiced doubts about the efficacy of a strike on Iran.
“We are saying there needs to be time for enhanced sanctions and diplomacy to work,” said Jeremy Ben-Ami, the president of J Street. “We’re trying to calm down the drumbeat of war.”
'In response to Netanyahu's AIPAC speech, Haaretz's editor-in-chief says that what looks like a preparation for war, acts like a preparation for war, and quacks like a preparation for war, is a preparation for war.
Since his return from Washington, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has mainly been preoccupied with one thing: Preparing public opinion for war against Iran.'
- Haaretz, 21 Adar, 5772 (today)
See workings of Zionist Lobby in
Mariella, if you read your own latest post, it will not be difficult to see that you are not presenting any argument at all.
Israel will now look weak if it does not attack Iran. Bumping off a few scientists is hardly plucky, bit cowardly more like.
Go baby, go baby go,go,go
Yawn!! Yawn!! Yawn!! SHock, horror some supporters of the Palestinian cause have fallen out. Now there's a revelation. I cannot believe anybody reads the rubbish that you post. I would imagine you find the EDL great bedfellows.
Sorry, Alexander, it's not up to me to trawl through every statement Rafsanjani has made throughout his long political career to disprove your own personal notion; you were the one claiming that he threatened a nuclear strike on Israel, and as I pointed out, the quote you provided said no such thing. In fact, it seemed merely hypothetical. If you have a link to the actual speech in its entirety - including its date - and, preferably, also a link to the Persian original, then by all means post it. I can't spin this coffee break out forever, but I'll take another look in the evening. Good luck with what I fear will be a fruitless search.
Mehdi Hasan is a contributing writer for the New Statesman and the co-author of Ed: The Milibands and the Making of a Labour Leader. He was the New Statesman's senior editor (politics) from 2009-12.