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Another war. Another Muslim madman with a funny name and a funny hat, sitting on top of unimaginable wealth. Funny how the circle goes around, first you're up, then you're down again.

What would we do if we didn't have Muslims to kick around?

I thought, though I never believed it, that next time things were supposed to be different? Next time, after Iraq, we were told our wonderfully free and critical media, and all the independent journalists, were going to be incredibly sceptical and critical about the war propaganda and hysteria flowing from our politicians. Next time there was going to be real, detailed scrutiny of the rumours and stories, not blind acceptance, especially in those countries involved in the military attacks, because one doesn't just go to war, a serious matter, based on uncorroborated and not independently verified stories, fed to one by partisans in the conflict, or does one?

And our glorious Parliament, full of glorious people, was not going to act as a mere rubber stamp. This time, after Blair, there was going to be real, thourough, and searching questions asked of the executive. This time hard facts and evidence, not rumours and stories. This time was going to be different from last time. We had all, the media, Parliament, the public; learnt something. Once bitten twice shy.

But maybe we should conclude that there is something structurally at fault with the way our media functions. That journalists are not all bad, but the system they work inside... is... bad. Not rotten apples, but a rotten, stinking, barrel?

So here we are again. Off to war based on propaganda, exaggeration and downright lies. But who cares? It doesnt' matter anymore.

The mainstream left are hopelessly naive and credulous to an extent that's frightening. Our leaders have discovered that all one has to do is present their newest Muslim madman in the right way, with the right adjectives and emotive labels, and hey presto, the clever and critical left fall into line behind the war-machine, like good little puppies.

Even the 'extreme" left are up for war, one just has to find the 'right' dictator, and off we go!

And one doesn't evern need that many sources for the stories, a mere handful, easily provided because the prize of getting the west to function as one's airforce is worth a bit of exaggeration and dramatising. And after all, who cares about details and who will even remember. If lies are what it takes to remove Gaddafi, then who cares, as long as he's gone?

All's fair in love and war.

That our media are structurally biased against Muslims and Islam, and therefore easily manipulated by corrupt and unscrupulous politicians who want, for a variety of reasons, to go to war against Muslim leaders; none of it seems to matter to anyone.

And if we uncritcally accept the assumptions and premises about Libya, logically we have to accept the conclusion of the arguments, that 'something has to be done.' But if the assumptions are based on propaganda lies and exaggereations, designed specifically to whip up war hysteria for yet another attack on an oil-rich Muslim country, what does this say to us about the true nature of our democracy?

it's a simple enough question. Are the stories about Gaddafi attacking unarmed and innocent civilians from the air, (committing acts of mass slaughter, massacres, and even genocide, the justification for the no-fly zone policy and the attacks), are they true or not?

Given that the information has come almost exclusively from bellicose partisans involved in the conflict, people with an obvious interest in the conflict, or those wishing to change the regime in Libya, should we be sceptical and very careful before jumping to conclusions and marching off to war? Isn't that the least one could ask for?

Yet, if the enemy is 'bad'enough, and 'mad' enough, is a Muslim, which seems to guarantee that they are both mad and bad, then our critical faculties are blunted and we become easy targets for manipulation in the cause of war. And this has happened so many times before, yet we seem unable, or unwilling to learn or remember anything. What is it about war that makes people so incredibly stupid?

And I've listened to politicians in all the belligerent countries ranting about this war, and they all sound remarkably similar; almost like they are singing from the same blood-spattered hymn-sheet. They are talk about Benghazi and genocide. What Gadaffi was going to do in the future, if we didn't stop him, as if the future is written in stone, and this is used as 'evidence' and a pretext for our pre-emptive attacks, now. Preventive war which can lead to anyting, because anyone can attack anybody, based on their version of what the enemy might do at some point in the future. How convenient if one wants to attack somebody.

No wonder big countries like India, Turkey, Brazil, Russia: most of South America, all of Afirca, even Germany, don't support this escalation in our ability to attack outher nations when we are not directly threatened ourselves.

Humnitarian war is the biggest confidence trick going, a cover for blatant imperialism.

And the Turks, the Russians, and the Chinese, could be next on the list for a bit of western 'humanitarian intervention', any country that has a restive minority in fact. But they'ed better make sure before they rise up against their oppressors that they have sufficient oil and gas to make it worth our while, rousing our humanitarian concience, doesn't come cheap!

And of course, this is the core problem for many people on the left and others. If my analysis is correct, and our democratic leaders, are not just hypocritical, but are cynically manipulating public opinion through propaganda, in order to create support for agressive war; well they are automatically not just mistaken, or hypocrites, but international war-criminals. To understand, contemplate, or accept this analysis has profound implications which many people instinctively don't want to face up to.

If our leaders are criminals, involved in international crimes, like agressive warfare to grab oil rich areas, under a pretext of feigned humanitarianism, can we really be said to still live under a 'democratic' system at all?

@writeon. Absolutely fantastic comment. You should really consider starting a blog lol.

Also, on a site where there are undoubtedly many intelligent and educated people encompassing the whole political landscape from left to right i find it very disheartening that people hold such bigoted views on Mr Hasan, (whose blog such people religiously follow) and on Islam and Muslims as a whole. I would like to begin with the latter. Surely people who visit this site have some sort of political awareness and an awareness of global issues. Yes without doubt there are several issues in many many Muslim countries, but theres issues in many countries that are not Muslims. In fact there seems to more issues for countries that are not in line with the Anglo-American view on the world as opposed to those that are. These issues are not inherent to Muslims or Islam, and it is totally ridiculous for anyone to imply so. All the injustices, the human rights abuses are a result of bad government usually or crackpot tyrants, supported wholeheartedly by western governments.
In regards to Mehdi Hasans comments of non-believers being 'cattle' and 'of no intelligence' are completely taken out of context (yes I m using that Bobby the Shoe). Just to provide you all with some context of Mr Hasan said in the now infamous talk to provide some sort of propective instead of using phrases in islotaion. here are some extracts
'We just follow the crowd, we are the cattle that Allah condemns in the Quran, and we can’t be. We can’t be. We have to acquire knowledge every day, night and day. And Rasoollah [the Holy Prophet] says…you have to go as far afield as China.

…

I watched this programme [“Science and Islam”, BBC4] and I really enjoyed it: a well-made programme, presenter very good…and yet I watched it with a sense of despair and a sense of sadness. Because this programme was pure history, every contribution was from the past, and the elephant in the room is the current Islamic contribution to knowledge and science and learning. Where was that in the series of programmes? It wasn’t there because fundamentally there isn’t one. That is the tragedy of our community today.

…

The Middle East, despite all its oil wealth…is an intellectually stagnant area of the world, where one in three Arabs, 65 million human beings, Muslims, are functionally illiterate, of which two thirds are women. 10 million children in the Middle East have never stepped foot inside a classroom, inside a school. That is the modern Muslim legacy. The Middle East…is now intellectually closed off to the outside world. … Closed off to the world – and let s not hear any of this nonsense about foreign literature, or foreign books, or foreign languages, being alien to Islam. It is the only way to learn, to open your minds to non-Muslims, to open your minds to other cultures, to learn foreign languages.

…

It is no surprise then that when you look at the Muslim world you see that we 1.2 billion Muslims have just 10 Nobel prizes to our name….and our Jewish brethren who we spend so much time fighting and arguing with, 12 million Jews in the world, they have 150 Nobel prizes to their name….We are not under-armed, we are under-educated. We have lost our ability to think, to acquire knowledge, to advance intellectually, and then we wonder why our community is in such decay, why globally wherever you find Muslims we have such problems. It’s not a secret, it’s not a conspiracy, its clear to anyone who looks at the numbers.

…

Just think about our priorities as a community, as a Muslim world, think about our priorities,: because when you look at our priorities….you look for example in the field of research and development…the West as an average spend around 2% of their GPD, their national income, on research and development…no Muslim country spends more than 0.5% of its national wealth on research and development…instead we spend the money on what? On killing, bombs, bloodshed, destruction, warfare, arms. Take Pakistan, for example, the “Islamic” Republic of Pakistan, with shamefully high levels of child illiteracy, and one of the world’s worst child labour problems, and yet it spends 20% of its GDP on its military and 2% of its GDP on education.'
Ultimately Mr Hasan was more critical of Muslims as opposed to the image of him preaching hard line Islamism like some would like to promote. He stressed the need for the Muslim world to be more progressive in their ideologies instead of being stuck in the culture of the distant past. These are the actions the Muslim world as a whole just take on board and implement. This is what we as the western world should want the Muslim world to adopt.

Actually critical thinking I'm just taking the piss.

@Mr Divine
Yes you silly prat but the moral argument is, asking if a Royal Bengal Tiger is a better organism than a ground leech!

Gaddafi is not a member of the Kuffar. He does not live like an animal.

Therefore, tout va bien.

Bobby the Shoe

British Politicians never tell the truth about anything to us citizens about domestic affairs, let alone foreign ones.
When Britain invaded India, in order to get our support they said all Indians were uncivilised animals and needed to be taught how to live like humans. When really they were after jewells, spices, materials etc. They also used Darwin's theory of Evolution (Survival of The Fittest) ie Our Superiority as a race over others to justify the injustices committed against the Indian people.
Now our government has a new enemy- The Muslims and all things Islamic. We know that all these Middle-Eastern countries are oil-rich and are muslim. Some of us are blindly following these nasty, manipulative tricks to again justify inflicting suffering on other human beings. We should all make an effort to find out about The True Islam -and not the media stereotypes that we are fed by the people at the top.

I am really annoyed with liberal/left wing journalists at the moment.... Such cowards. Yes, we should not listen to Blair on these issues.

Would you care to let us know your opinions Medhi? Is the current action the correct path. If you disagree then why won't you say it out right (what happened to the responsibility journalists should have to hold governments to account).

If you agree then also it would be worth hearing. I suspect though you are a coward. You know that the issue is complex so you do the easy thing at criticise Blair and do not commit to a position while politicians have to do so. Then in 3 years time you can claim the moral high ground.

I find it hard to believe that innocent people have not been killed or maimed by coalition 'bombing'.
You can't throw massive bombs around with accuracy. They claimed this in Iraq but as we now know, many innocent lives were lost or ruined.
Just imagine if bombs were being dropped in our country, we wouldn't be saying 'it's ok they're not aiming for us', we would be terrified. It's so wrong and Cameron is a dick.

Brilliant Mr Divine.

Medhi, you sound abit Naive.

Lets talk of hypocrisy in that part of the world...

For some reason all the regimes and the people in the region are now showing there savage, brutal colors. The world is seeing how the leaders and the people behave towards each other with utter ruthlessness.

Somehow Israel is supposed to make peace with these same minded people? Somehow Israel is judged by a different set of rules when it trys to defend itself from these wicked and evil Islamists?

Lets talk of the hypocrisy of Medhi living amongst the Kuffar, judging us our way of life and while holding us in contempt?

Where is his true expose on the wickedness of Islam and how it has created the terrible social and political issues in the middle east??

If you want to talk about hypocrisy - how about the Council of the League of Arab Nations calling for the no fly zone and protection of civillians then basically washing their hands of it and leaving it for the West to enforce?

I say let them do their own dirty work for a change. Remember the Wikileaks cable from Saudi Arabia to the US regarding Iran? It reminded me of the class sneak encouraging the class bully to pick on the class twat.

Bobby, I only asked a question. To be honest it does not matter, but that's not the point. The point is that when Mehdi says anything it gets taken out of context but when anyone else says anything against Islam is due to 'freedom of speech'. Anyway I didn't ask in anyway... aren't people allowed to ask questions? War mongering zionists follow the talmud, and these are the same ones who create propaganda against muslims.It's important to bring to light what different books say, so that you're enlightened rather than making comments on absolutely no knowledge. I have no idea how anyone lives, and will not make a judgement on it, however Islam calls for the purification of the soul. By the way Saudi Arabia is not an example of a muslim country when King Abdullah is a drinking, oil selling tyrant, who opresses a good 20-30% and does not give them their human rights.

By the way, good for you that you are more educated than anyone else. (However you came to this conclusion)

Why don't you say Medhi if you approve of the UN defending Benghazi? Would you let Gaddafi' retake Benghazi?

What are you answers?

Everything else is journalistic waffle and irrelevance.

Point5: I am here and alive

Hawks! or peace keepers, Medhi, such anthromorphising, what about the muslim dogs who killed each other like dogs in the Holy Mosque in Mecca? Hawks or raptors, or Carrion Kites or do they have to deal with too many oriental shite-hawks!!!!

Bobby the Shoe

If you are educated as you say, please read this. If after, you still persist with this line of attack then so be it.

http://www.newstatesman.com/blogs/dissident-voice/2009/07/islamic-extrem...

I'd be very interested to see your response.

Thanks

If it's found when and if this conflict ever ends, we can all be sure Mehdi Hasan will be reporting on the tens of thousands killed by our and UN forces, whilst remaining silent on Gaddafi's genocide!

Having said that we should not be there it's none of our business, how would you all feel with Arab forces enforcing a no-fly zone over our country?

To all commentators justice is key word upon which everething should be base.

Things are not always black and white since grey do exist.

War against a groupe of people for wordly,financial,economic gain of the few is evil.

The event of Japan should be a lessons for everyone because the decree of the ever powerful the creator of all comes no one can overturn it.

How far do you think you will get with this greed to accumulate wordly things and disregarding the injunction of Justice in all?

Carry on if you whish but remember arrogant,tyrant,terrorist,oppressor,liar,deception all will never succeed.

But truth,justice will always prevails.

Finally let's remember that there is more to what eyes sees.

I invite all of us to aim for justice not greed nor deceiving.

Thank you all

in a recent article in the new statesman, you claimed that 'israel has used the criswis in libya as another oppurtunity to bomb...' this is possibly one of the most anti israel comments i've ever heard, even by your standards. how is it so that in the same pararaph, you fail to mention that a family was bludgeoned to death in the West Bank and that there has been an enormous surge of rockets into israel rather than 'a round'. awful journalism

'Politicians are the rent boys of multi-national corporations.'

Quite.

Remember when Gaddafi said that "those protesters were nothing but 17 year olds on hallucinagenic drugs given to them br the Al Queda?

Well there is an article in the Information Clearing House http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article27759.htm titled Gadaffi could be right about Al Queda.

It now seems that the west has now been cought up in a rather nasty dilema by interfering it is up to the Libian people to get rid of Gadaffi!!!

I mean dropping tons of bombs on Libian cities is a rather a Sledgehammer approach to the problem isn't it?