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"Maurice Glasman's actions have made supporting the project untenable."
Tags: Blue Labour
Maybe The Adam Smith institute forgot to include the working classes who are working in minimum wage jobs, waiting for a council house and whom have seen their communities changed beyond recognition by mass immigration.
Alistair - I think you're confusing the death of British industry brought about by Thatcher with Immigration. Where previously the working class had the option of skilled industrial work, now it's minimum wage, highly casualised or off the books mostly. That's not the fault of people from abroad. That's squarely at the feet of someone from Grantham.
The problem with Blue Labour is that it actually approaches difficult issues.
This is far too much to cope with for the fluffy-headed clowns that infest the New Statesman and The Labour Party.
How dare someone disturb their comfort zone of self-righteous narcissism.
What about their empty sloganeering, why can't that do the trick?
"Free mansions for the poor!"
"A living wage for the unemployed - £75,000 a year"
Forget all this xenophobic claptrap, let's get back to real ideas like "multiculturalism" and shouting stuff at buildings while holding placards.
The Labour Party - where anyone who doesn't spout idiotic 19th Century Marxist crap about "equality" is "reactionary".
How about some Islamic Funda-Feminist International Socialism? It's bound to be a big thing on the estates.
Ridiculous kneejerk reaction. He is only a policy adviser for goodness' sake, not the leader or shadow home secretary. Amazing that a party that completely pissed on its founding principles during 13 years in power can sack an adviser when his views on immigration don't fall in line with doctrine. I would submit that Labour were afraid Glasman's ideas might actually have gone down too well with the public. The fallout would be Labour having to admit they were wrong the last time. Heaven forbid.
@Stuey Eels. Are you being 'sargastic' ? !
Thank God Labour are distancing themselves from his comments.With sensible ideas like that the labour party would be able to win more votes.I hope they keep pumping out their normal idiotic ideas that keep them where they belong in opposition.
Immigration is about keeping wages down and higher profits, pure and simple.
More socialism for the rich and capitalism for the poor.
Who benefits from immigration?
I don't, my children don't, the British working class, both black and white, don't.
Who benefits, Dan?
Paul Hillyard - Look, stop talking crap. There's no evidence for your claims whatsoever. 2 million people have been unemployable over the last decade and have been allowed to live on the dole, whilst 2 million immigrants came into the country. Basically if those immigrants didn't come then our economy would have gone into recession. If someone had bothered to try and get the 2 million unemployable to get training and qualifications to become employable then there would automatically have been less employment because there would have been much more competition for jobs.
In any case wages would have been much the same because there would have been the same amount of competition for jobs regardless if it was the British unemployable applying for jobs or immigrants.
Middle income earners (which is the new working class) have only suffered in that many of the jobs they once did are either no longer needed or can be done cheaper abroad. Unfortunately instead of developing new hi-tech industry and manufacturing we have done f*ck all about the need to replace old defunct industries with new ones.
'If someone had bothered to try and get the 2 million unemployable to get training and qualifications to become employable then there would automatically have been less immigration(not employment) because there would have been much more competition for jobs.'
Maurice Glasman rang just about every alarm bell you could mention. He & Ed Miliband were giving interviews on the direction they wanted Labour to take the day before asking the Labour party grassroots what direction they wanted to take. This sent a clear message: "We really don't care what direction you want to go in - we're doing what we want regardless". Ed was elected on the back of union support but ever since he appears to have been snubbing them & pandering to knuckl-dragging, Daily Mail induced ignorance about immigration & crime, coming out with lines that could have come straight from J-M LePen in the '90s. As a left-wing Labour supporter who forsook them in the Blair years because of the way Blair took the party into Tory territory, I look at what Glasman says & think "Oh no - not again!"
I managed to lose a long response to Guy Debord, so here's my short answer. Thanks for responding BTW. 3 million or so immigrants in a decade was too many. Existing citzens were not asked if they agreed. Too many new arrivals have no interest in ths country other than to make some money or to live more comfortably than they did in their home country.
Lastly, I'm afraid that you are rather glib, Guy, about the reality of mass immigration rather than your utopian fantasies
Is it inconceivable that we could have relatively liberal immigration laws AND better protection of workers' rights, better vocational training, a higher minimum wage?
Germany is an example of a country which has experienced mass immigration over the last 20 years yet maintained a strong economy and relatively low inequality.
The late Labour government have often sung the praises of multicultural Britain. We are given an account of British life where whites, blacks and Asians live side by side in perfect harmony. But as someone who has lived in London for the past 8 years and in Luton for four years prior to that I would have to challenge Labours assertion.
Areas of Luton (namely Bury Park) are dominated by one ethnic group....Pakistani Muslims; in London places like Wembley are dominated by blacks with very few white people living there. In Southall Indians dominate the locality; in areas of the East End of London (Brick Lane to name one place) is dominated by Bangladeshis. When areas such as this are populated largely by one ethnic group is this really evidence of a blossoming multicultural society? I think not. What is happening in these areas is that they are being COLONISED by certain ethnic groups. It is fair to say that London consists of a patchwork of different communities with different interests and agendas ...the demand for sharia law by some muslims being one example. This trend is a threat to the stability and the cohesion of this country.
You might not like Glasman's views, seeing as how they highlight all of Labour's failings in 13 years in Government, but he is absolutely right on just about everything and, more to the point, is completely in tune with the views and feelings of the wider electorate which neither Labour nor the Tories, let alone the LibDems, are anymore.
A Modest manifesto.
1.Defend the (white) working class by repealing the anti-trade union laws and encouraging trade union membership. Active and strong trade unions are a precondition of an equal society.
2.Defend the (non-white) working class be repealing the trade union laws, and encouraging trade union membership. Trade unions haven't always been progressive on race and migrants, but are at the forefront today. Trade unions mobilise around common issues that transcend cultural differences.
3. Recognise that global migration is rarely 'free' and that the 'right to roam' implies a 'right to a home'. Regulate global markets at an international level, ban the arms trade, invest in sustainable development and in education, particularly for girls. Support fair trade at a global level.
4. Build cohesive communities by investing in jobs and local infrastructure, encouraging credit unions and other forms of local finance, banning faith and selective schools, and reforming local government to enhance transparency.
4.Revive a common sense of citizenship by removing the vote from those who opt out of publicly funded education. Those who choose not to participate in public education and other common services (including health care) have no right to make decisions that affect those who do participate. Privileged cosmopolitans are most at home in airports. Let them stay there.
20 July 2011 at 16:02 " Power had obviously gone to his head. Imagine comparing yourself to Aristotle." ...................He didn't. He said he's influenced by him. If you can't read a paragraph, refrain from commenting.
Maurice Glasman is great - a very bright, articulate thinker AND personable and humble. I think his ideas are bang on and his detractors have tripped themselves up with their wishy-washy, liberal ideas. Shame on the Labour Party cowards who don't have the guts to turn it around for the people. Shame on them.
Blimey, he's lost the support of some academic from Middlesex University...not exactly the A-list this, is it?
To: Dan Hodges
Do you disagree with any of the asserions set out below.
1. The total population of the UK in 2030 is gonna be between 72 and 75 million.
2. Approx 40% of these people are gonna be living within a 55 mile radius of Charing Cross Station
3. Eight to nine million of these people will be non European
4. Bradford, Leics Birmingham and all the inner boroughs of London will be maj non white some time before this date.
5. There are at least a million illegal immigrants currently residing in the UK, and probably closer to three million.
6. Afro Carribean yoof are massively over represented in every category of crime, especially sex crimes, drugs offences and street robberies.
7. US style "white flight" has been occurring for over twenty years, especially from south London to the southern home counties and from the East end to Essex, but also in other cities such as Brum
This is the NS
Not to much reality please
stuart eels ,for one I agree
Power had obviously gone to his head. Imagine comparing yourself to Aristotle.
Dan, most people do not support several hundred thousand people coming in to this country every year.
Why do certain parts of the Left (and I use "Left" advisedly) support mass immigration in any case? And why the hell do they keep denying that 3 million or so immigrants over the last decade has had quite profoundly negative effects on the country's quality of life and community cohesion?
Glasman is only stating the obvious. EU freedom of movement was not designed to enable 1 million Poles to come here (which is not so much immigration as transplantation).
Asylum lawas were not designed for Afghan nationals to cross Europe and camp at Calais waiting to come and live in the UK.
I hope that removing the Primary Purpose laws were not designed for relatively recent arrivals to bring large parts of their extended families to live in the UK.
Some parts of the Left are so far away from mainstream public opinion that I question their grasp on reality, let alone electability.
John Cronin - There's nothing wrong with having a higher population. About 85% of the UK is rural so we do have a hell of a lot of space to accomodate for a higher population.
Indeed around 2050 we are projected to have a population of 77 million with about 7.5 - 8 million people being non-white. That will mean that 69 million people will be white. We whities will hardly be overrun!
There is considered to be around 600,000 illegal immigrants in the UK but obviously you can't know for sure. It's a disgrace that we have people living as second class citizens with no rights whatsoever. We should have an amnesty and not allow this to go on any longer.
If you look at socio-economic groups, poor white 'yoofs' commit a similar level of crime as black kids. Because a large percentage of white people are in higher socio-economic groups than black people it distorts the figures. In any case white people commit the most sexual crimes. Indeed white people tend to commit the most depraved crimes be it sex crimes, assaults or murders.
In any case skin colour is very insignificant. Scientifically it means very little.
If I could be bothered to work myself up to a lather by your accusation that I'm a racist, I would waste as much of my life as you stuck in front of a computer.
You show yourself to be more of a racist with your disgusting remarks about the patron of Public Houses than most of the people bothering to reply to you.
Are you Laurie Penny in disguise?
Rob - Why are you so bothered about 'mainstream public opinion'? Are you a lemming and just agree with whatever opinion polls tell you?
I suppose you also think Britney Spears is amazing.
Sam, public opinion is important in a democracy. Especially when it is correct. Clearly you understand very little.
Also, you say "It's a disgrace that we have people living as second class citizens with no rights whatsoever."
You are right. They should be deported, and much more quickly than they are now, as they have no right to be here.
And third, there is an awful lot wrong with having an ever higher population on a finite amount of land. Quality of life, environmental destruction are two things that spring to mind. Why don't you try campaigning in London for an increase in population and see what "mainstream public opinion" (or ordinary people as they are known) tells you.
By the way, when did you and reality get divorced?
We are often told by many liberal/left wing commentators that cultural and racial diversity has made an immensely positive contribution to life in the UK. The late Robin Cook spoke of how chicken tikka masala has become the nation dish of Britain; Tony Benn said the fact that some 20% of schoolchildren coming from ethnic minority backgrounds provide ‘a wonderful snapshot of multicultural Britain’.
However what about the politics of race and multiculturalism? Nowadays freedom of speech is curtailed for the sake of ‘multicultural harmony’ under the fascist restriction of political correctness. This has undermined British identity in many ways including those labour controlled councils of Hounslow and Lewisham who refuse to fly the Union Jack from their council buildings on the charge that the union jack is ‘socially divisive’. The very British feature of humour has also been undermined. For instance do we see Bernard Manning, Alf Garnett or Jim Davidson on TV anymore? These comics have been replaced by the less inspiring left –wing personalities such as Marcus Bridgstock, Jonathon Ross, Jo Brand and Frank Skinner who will dare offend no one -other than white heterosexual right wing males!
We are told by politicians of the economic benefits of mass immigration to the UK. Indeed it is true that mass immigration has provided a cheap supply of labour to businesses, which has kept prices and inflation low and has helped employers to fill positions where apparently British workers have not had adequate skills to fulfil the role.
However, the cheap supply of labour provided by mass immigration has kept the minimum wage low, helping to sustain higher profits for employers but thereby making the gap between high and low income earners more profound and kept the lowest income earners in a cycle of poverty. The ability of employers to recruit skilled workers from abroad has robbed British workers of the opportunity to be trained to have the skills to undertake certain employment.
In housing the Labour Government has failed to build enough council houses meaning that the supply of housing has been inadequate to meet the need of the settled population to the extent where there are some 1.6 million people waiting for council accommodation. This problem is of course exacerbated by mass immigration where newcomers often seek cheap private and council housing.
The way that attitudes to assimilation into UK life for immigrants has been mismanaged. Indeed look at areas of Luton, Bradford, Birmingham and East London where immigrant communities have transformed the area to match their way of life to the country from which they came. It seems that there is too much emphasis from immigrants on the country from which they are from –and not the one they are in! It has got to the point where a recent opinion poll found that 40% of all Muslims in the UK want to live under Sharia Law, which is in effect holding the established laws of the UK in contempt.
How many of us are abroad taking other indigenous populations' jobs?
The only difference is; we are treated with respect when we work abroad, whereas we treat non-Brits with such hostility.
And, I will never be part of labour policy/institution pre-fix with 'Blue'. I can just hear Cameron at question time mocking ED for wanting a bit of blue.
Who are these Labour stretegist who were advising Ed to sign up to 'BlueLabour'. They do not havbe a clue.
Where was the mandate for the mass immigration that Britain experienced in the 13 years of Labour? It is very well complaining that many Britons are against multiculturalism BUT did we have a referendum on this in the first place?
The elephant in the Room:
HOW HAS MASS IMMIGRATION BENEFITTED THE WHITE WORKING CLASSES????
(direct answers will be appreciated)
norman disowsi, well said, any mention of laurie penny,is like mentioning godwins' law.
john cronin, bit blunt ,but true, how dare Vaz laugh at Andy hayman and then shout order order ,when asked in a straight face ,without any politeness are you on the take", this frm a bloke who was suspended from parlainemt for a month to lying to the police about a female harrassing him, his links with the Hidujas' and the £90,000 he claimed for expences on his mortgage,
john cronin well said aswell
Mass immigration has NEVER beneffited the white working class. Ask anyone who was born in North West London in the early 50's and 60's. They will tell you in no uncertain terms as I would.
Anyone who admits being influenced by the pope should be in some far right outfit.
Shakin' the Blues Away! And Ed is stuck with a communications director straight out of central casting. In spite of all the huffing and puffing from the political right the individual in question is probably a straight arrow. Nevertheless, the Murdoch brand is not easy to change - even with a branding iron. Aping the conventional types is something Tony could do with aplomb. Gordon bombed!
Immigration is an issue the Tories are going to resurrect again and again.
Just like the old Ancient Roman aristocrats did as they replaced their various tribes people with immigrants from the four corners of the earth. Of course, in the interim, there was a kind of welfare state doling out bread and circuses.
Let's not forget the problems facing the Euro, the USA's financial civil war over the racial issue, and North Africa, Afghanistan and the Middle-East in chaos.
Look, what was Andy Coulson doing working for Cameron. And don't forget Dr Kelly's phone. And Andy Milligan's. Surely Andy is investigating the hacking mystery
Old Labour. New Labour. Blue Labour. Who f**king cares which Labour. Labour without the skilled working-class will stay in the political wilderness.
The end of Blue Labour. thank God for that. now can we have real Labour. you know the one where Labour stands up for the NHS. and the disabled. and a message for Mr Maurice Glasman if you want a party that's Blue try the Tories
I didn't accuse you of being a racist. No one's mentioned race. I said you and your like minded friends below the line reminded me of a group of boorish, ignorant men. I never mentioned race.
Xenophobia, sure, but not racism. You brought that up.
red mary 'REAL' Labour now what the f**k would that be, very few inside the parliamentary Labour party know what Labour is?
I do love it when the anti-immigration crowd on here get going (Cronin, Reid, Eels etc..)
It reminds me of this pub where I used to work in Lincolnshire where there would always be a group of fat, ruddy faced, pig ignorant bores supping pints of Bombardier and banging on and on about how how the "country was going to the dogs cos of johnny foreigner" (despite the fact you could guarantee they'd never met anyone from outside the county, let alone the country)
It used to make me incredibly angry, hearing words and phrases like "indigenous population", "mass immigration", "them". Now I think it's just sad. People desperately clinging to an idea that people are separate and must be kept so and that "we" remain the priority whereas "they" can go hang. As though those terms had some kind of meaning.
If progress is anything, it's the slow, almost imperceptible but tangible decline and eventual extinction of obsolete ideas and categories like nation, separation, boundaries and borders.
I feel for people who are still stuck in these notions, constantly wanting to put up more walls, higher and stronger than before, trying to close themselves and their perception of what the world is away from everyone else, even from each other.
It must be a very grey place, no colour, variety or change, trying to recapture something which was never there in the first place.
It's an attitude and a worldview which isn't limited to the boorish invective on show in many of these comments threads, it's all over the world, anywhere where people regard identity as being linked to place in anything more than the most tenuous of senses.
One can only hope that these defunct ideas will have the grace to die out quickly, with a minimum of fuss.
Pathetic knee jerk response by Jon Cruddas and Jonathan Rutherford. This inability to sensibly discuss immigration and frame it in terms of British interests, is what lead to the rupture of trust between Labour and the public.
They should listen to Glasman and they might find themselves back in office.
Alistair Cole, and all the others who are trying to use logical arguments with Sam or Dan-- it's pointless using logic on the left-wing. They do not care what majority opinion is, and they think immigration can just go on forever ("lots of nice green unspoiled countryside left to build over"). What I can't understand is
WHY they have this obsession with mass immigration - it's like a religion with them!
Labour no longer know's who or what we represent....
Here is something Glasman is correct about:
"Mass immigration under Labour, he believes, served to ‘act as an unofficial wages policy.’ The party's position, Glasman contends, occupied a ‘weird space where we thought that a real assault on the wage levels of English workers was a positive good.'
"Globalization, he argues, may be a fact, but it is not a fate. ‘There are different strategies of ... mediation and the one that appeals to me most is the one pursued by Germany.'"
"The German economy with its worker representation on the management board, works councils, pension co-determination, regional banks and vocational regulation, in other words with high levels of democratic interference in the economy, emerged with a more efficient workforce, greater growth and with a genuinely modern industrial sector."
Mass-immigration buried Labour. Labour simply can't be trusted with our borders. Because many on the political-left don't believe in borders, but would never say that in public.
Unfortunately this is where we are at with respect to this subject. One seemingly cannot have a rational debate in this country because everyone apart from a few brave thick skinned souls and the genuinely racist are frightened of the subject. It's effectively been closed down because merely to raise any doubts about the wisdom of allowing thousands of foreigners into to this country is deemed a dangerous topic - fraught with indiscriminatly charged incendiary bombs waiting to blow up and engulf the perpetrator in a holocaust of controversy.
Luddite real Labour is the party who used to stand up for the NHS and the disabled which if you had bothered to read my post is what I said. these days they seem to be trying to outdo the Tories in who can kick the poor the hardest
@alistair cole. i agree.